The Informed Traveler
The Informed Traveler
Multi-Generational Travel, Pure Grenada & Summer Travel Trends
Multigenerational travel is on the increase for a number of reasons but there are a some important things to consider so on this week's show travel expert Onanta Forbes will be here to offer up some tips to plan a successful multigenerational trip. And one destination you might want to consider for a multigenerational vacation is the Caribbean island of Grenada so we'll learn all about visiting Grenada. And we've got a bonus segment for you this week as Dani Musse from Booking.com will join us to discuss their latest summer travel trends survey.
Well, hello and welcome to the Informed Traveler Podcast, a weekly travel podcast where our goal is to help you become a more informed traveler. I'm your host, Randy Sharman. Multi-generational travel is on the increase for a number of reasons, but there are some important things to consider. So in a few seconds, travel expert, Onanda Forbes, will be here to offer up some tips to plan a successful multi-generational trip. And one destination you might want to consider for a multi-generational vacation is the Caribbean be an island of Grenada. So later in the show, we'll learn all about visiting Grenada. And we've got a bonus segment for you this week as Danny Mucey from Booking.com will join us to discuss their latest summer trends survey. But first, let's kick things off chatting with travel expert Onanta Forbes, who joins us each week to discuss some of the travel news and travel trends. You can follow her adventures on Instagram, Facebook, and X at Onanta Forbes. Onantaforbes.com is her website. Hi, Onanta.
SPEAKER_02:Hi, Randy. How are you?
SPEAKER_01:Very well, thank you. We're going to talk about multi-generational travel, two or three generations, maybe four, of family members traveling together. Is this something you're seeing more and more of?
SPEAKER_02:Yes, absolutely. And it could be for a variety of different reasons. Maybe you're going for a family reunion. Maybe you're going for a wedding. Maybe you're just going because COVID hit us all very hard and we realized that time together is important.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, so who usually initiates this? I would assume it's the people with the most money.
SPEAKER_02:That is very true. Yes, and that's true because they have more time. to maybe think about it they want to encourage their family members to get together and you're right they have more money and they um and you know maybe even the kids are still living with them
SPEAKER_03:well this is true
SPEAKER_02:so so lots of different reasons but i think um You know, family is important, even if it's not your biological family. You collect family sometimes from friends and, you know, people that you've known along the way. So and blended families are huge these days. So it can get quite big, but it doesn't have to be big as far as what you're thinking about going. And, you know, just because I'm a travel advisor, I'm not just saying this, but it's really good. to enlist a travel advisor because your trip can get a little complicated. You may be coming from different gateways throughout maybe Canada or even the world. So it's good to have that person who has a broad range of knowledge and can look at the big picture. And then you ask yourself, well, why are you going on this trip? Is it to enjoy a beach resort or a destination? Are you going, as I say, to a wedding? So there's different reasons to go. And then depending on why you're going, maybe what the destination is, is a factor. Like, do you want to go somewhere far away? Or do you want to go somewhere that's easy reach? Like a Mexico is hugely popular destination for families, for Canadians in general. And so it's good to have that travel advisor, Randy, to consider all the different needs of people. So are there kids involved? Is it adult family members? You know, like what do people want to achieve when they're at that destination?
SPEAKER_01:Well, yeah, there's lots of things to consider. And I always... use you know the grandparents taking uh their children and the grandchildren as a classic example of multi-generational travel but yeah you brought up some some different ones that uh yeah there's there's different all kinds of dynamics that are in there and one of course is accommodation i must i would think that if a family gets along pretty good normally chances are they'll have a pretty good time but if there's one or two people that uh irritate some other people maybe like a Maybe you don't want to be staying in one area. You might want to have your own separate place or something to that effect.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and you're right. Disagreements will likely happen sooner or later just because people are people, right? So one of the things that you could consider... actually two things, is either an all-inclusive resort or a cruise. Because it's good to have the opportunity to have different activities for different age groups, different interests. You know, an all-inclusive, depending on the age of the kids, looking for somewhere that has a kids club, maybe that has babysitting available to you. So it's good to have those options. at your fingertips. Then you have to kind of think of, you know, how much work do you want to do at destination? Whereas an all-inclusive, you have your flights, your transfers, your accommodations, work with your travel advisors, you can create some and book some activities ahead of time. I know Catamount, Orion Cruises are really big and just different types of things to do. Because when you go away and you don't maybe have all the features at your fingertips, you're going to have to look at logistics, right? And one of the biggest things is transportation. Yes. Are you going to be trading in e-bikes? Are you going to be using public transit? Are you going to rent a car, a renting car depending on the destination? Could be straightforward, like when we go to Hawaii, pretty easy to drive there, right? But if you're going to Europe, you perhaps may be driving on the opposite side of the road. The roads are smaller. It could be a little bit more challenging. And then, you know, looking at how many people are with you, cramming all those people in one vehicle.
SPEAKER_01:Well, exactly. That's a really good point, I can recall. And it wasn't really a multi-generational trip, but... We were with family members, my niece and her husband and my brother and his wife and my family. And transportation became a logistical, I wouldn't say nightmare, but you're traveling with seven or eight people all the time. And then we were in Mexico. You certainly need a van everywhere you go. And so that's one thing to consider that you can't all pile into one of those small little taxis.
SPEAKER_02:Right. Absolutely. So, you know, you might want to consider even hiring a private vehicle which comes with a driver so you don't have to worry. us need naps, young or old, you know, so maybe that's important to our, or just sitting on your balcony if you're at a beach destination, just admiring the beach, you know, just kind of taking in those vibes. But what I would suggest definitely is that you start early as far as planning. So, you know, six months to eight months, if not a year, depending on when the prices are released by our tour operators, you know, we'll ensure the best deals I'm flights and accommodation and allow really the time necessary to coordinate schedules and preferences. And it's a good tip to involve everybody. True. Yeah, yeah. Not maybe everybody has the same discretionary funds if everybody's paying individually. It's always wonderful to have that person to pay for it all, but that's just not always happening, right?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah, if someone's offering it up and saying, yeah, we have the means, we'd like to do this, that's one thing. That's another thing for the expectation of, well, are you paying for this?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, really. And then, yeah, being flexible as well. Like we just talked about that. And two, if you are going to, you know, there's a lot of people that believe in, you know, booking VRVOs for that bigger space. Then you have to consider the meals, grocery shopping, cooking together, or even going, get figured out a restaurant to go to. Because sometimes that's, that can be tricky in a sense where can they accommodate the number of your friends and family at the end of the day and such? Yeah, so it's always good to enjoy something where it's just there, like a cruising. We've talked about how popular cruising is and how a lot of people are repeat cruisers, and they refer cruising to their friends and family. And it's definitely an option for multi-generation trips. You get to see so many different destinations in one week, right, if you're going from place to place. Yes. kind of fun as well too um so lots of lots of choice out there these days i have to say that and um You can make it like, you know, lots of opportunity to make it fit your budget at the end of the day.
SPEAKER_01:I like the cruise idea because there is lots of things to do for everybody. And you're not in everybody's face the whole time. You can go out and do your own thing. Same with the all-inclusives as well. When you're talking about like a VRBO or something like that, someone always gets stuck with the work.
SPEAKER_03:Right.
SPEAKER_01:It always seems to me kind of unfair and the work is never divided properly. So, yeah, to me, a cruiser and all-inclusive is the way to go, but each to their own.
SPEAKER_02:Right. And, you know, really consider VRBOs as what the expectation of the owner is to the renter.
UNKNOWN:Right.
SPEAKER_02:do you have to clean up? Like how much do you have to clean up afterwards? Or is there a cleaning fee? Is there a fee to heat the pool? You know, if you're going to a destination and a property that has a pool. So there's lots of, add-ons that you may not accept. So always read your contract. That's what I can say. Read the fine print.
SPEAKER_01:Good advice. Good tips. Onanda Forbes is a travel expert. You can follow her on Facebook, Instagram, x at Onanda Forbes. OnandaForbes.com is the website. Thanks, Onanda. Thank you. Have a good day. Have a good week. Well, we were just talking about multi-generational travel, and one place you might want to consider for a family trip is the Caribbean island of Grenada. So joining me now to share all the great things Grenada has to offer visitors is Stacey Libert. She is the CEO of Grenada Tourism Authority. PureGrenada.com is their website. Hi, Stacey. Hi,
SPEAKER_04:how are you?
SPEAKER_01:I'm very well, thank you. I'm excited to learn about Grenada. I've been to many places. Caribbean islands, but I haven't been to Grenada, so I'm excited to learn all about it. Let's start with the basics, I guess. Where is it located in the Caribbean?
SPEAKER_04:Oh my gosh, that means you have to get here because it's one of those bucket list destinations. We are wedged in between Trinidad and St. Vincent, if anyone has been there. It's a beautiful destination that is rich in heritage, natural beauty, cultural richness. Our visitors can explore historic forts, spice markets, artisan villages. Great in terms of those who are looking for something that is off the beaten path because we have 40 white sand beaches, nine black sand beaches, 15 waterfalls, and untouched rainforests. There is so much that you can do. And of course, we have amazing food. The destination is very safe. So for those who are looking for that truly immersive experience, this is the destination for you.
SPEAKER_01:Well, I am looking on your website, puregrenada.com. Interesting where you got the title of Pure Grenada. It's different from, you know, most websites where
SPEAKER_04:it's, you know, blah, blah, blah, tourism or whatever. So where did that come from? in a destination, in a vacation, pure captures it all, right? We're the spice island and, you know, all of our spices are grown on the island and used in our dishes, right? You know, when you think about, you know, just being able to relax and breathe in that natural fresh air, there's nothing more pure about that. It really is a destination that you disconnect to reconnect with your family, with your friends, with your loved ones and just be able to immerse yourselves in the culture.
SPEAKER_01:Well, again, it's on your website, puregrenada.com. You have sections for adventurers, memory makers, wellness seekers, families. So, you know, I always say that it's an overused term, but there is really something for everyone if you're looking for a vacation, right?
SPEAKER_04:Absolutely. Absolutely. And I think that's one of our unique selling points, right? Is there is something for everyone. Because think about when you travel with your family, right? Your wife wants to go to the spa. You know, you want... to do something that is fun and outdoorsy and adventure focused. Your kids probably want to spend a day at the pool or on the beach. So there really is something for the entire family and couples and groups and girlfriends traveling. I also think that because we're seeing a rise in solo travelers, it really also does speak to the safety of a destination when a male or female can travel on their own. I think even more so women because you're not going to go somewhere where you don't feel safe, right? So I think that the mere fact that you can travel to this destination that you've never been to before and make friends and feel like you can venture outside of your resort and be safe and have a wonderful experience.
SPEAKER_01:Well, let's talk a little bit about that. Just getting there, the logistics, I'm assuming there's a main place, a main city where you fly into and then you can sort of branch out from there, right?
SPEAKER_04:Absolutely. It depends on also where you're coming from, right? We just recently announced that Delta Airlines will be servicing Atlanta to Grenada beginning December 20th. But if you're coming from New York, of course, you have JetBlue as an option. If you're coming from Miami, you have American Airlines as an option. But if you're coming from Toronto, you have Air Canada as an option. You have WestJet as an option, which is a seasonal flight. We also have Lyft servicing the UK route with British Airways into St. Lucia and Virgin Atlantic into Barbados. So it's very easy to get to the destination. And once you get there, I mean, your vacation starts the minute the pilot says, welcome to Grenada.
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Good way of saying that. So is that sort of what people do? They sort of plant themselves in one part of Grenada and then you just kind of branch out and do day trips? Is it small enough to do that?
SPEAKER_04:of course definitely the island is very easy to to navigate and so we have amazing you know tour guides and tour operators who will be able to you know uh you know drive you around the island to experience you know different things depending on your needs um so it's it's it's really easy and then also if you are someone who's adventurous and you want to rent a vehicle and drive yourselves around then of course that is also an option are you know i i am new to the island and And I found that using Google Maps was very easy. So, you know, again, it speaks to the friendliness and the warmth of the people. And again, how just, you know, you don't need to worry about being able to go out and venture about.
SPEAKER_01:So what are some of the popular activities? Like, what are some of the favorite things you like to do or recommend?
SPEAKER_04:Okay, well, I have to tell you, you have to try our underwater sculpture park. It has 75 sculptures ranging from five to eight meters in depth. It is amazing. It is beautiful. And we recently added five new unique installations, including the collection of 25 sculptures titled Coral Carnival. And it is amazing because it is beautiful. It's great for divers. And even if you snorkel, I am not a diver, and I went to the one in Carriaco, which is our sister island, and I was able to see it from the boat. Oh, nice. Yeah, it's really amazing, and that's one thing I would definitely suggest. Of course, going to see one of our... I'm sorry, waterfalls. We have so many waterfalls and that is something that is truly amazing. and amazing to see and swim and experience. I also suggest doing a food tour to be able to try the different cuisine on the island. I also love the idea or the fact that you can go to any one of our properties to experience whether it's their dining options, whether it's their spa services, you know, whatever it is that you're looking for. It is. It is available on the island. The other thing that you have to do when you are on the island is try our oil down, which is a national dish. It is delicious. And this is something that I tell anyone. Go to, you know, one of our, you know, food markets or one of our restaurants and ask to try oil down. And then, of course, you have to go to one of Belmont Estates to see how, you know, chocolate is made. They also... Yes, they also do some really great cheeses there. I recently tried some goat cheese from there. That was absolutely delicious. You know, they have a great farm to table experience in their restaurant with the lunch and then of course, rum tasting. You have to try some of our local rums for sure.
SPEAKER_01:For sure. Chocolate and rum. There you go.
SPEAKER_04:That's a great combination, right? It's a great combination,
SPEAKER_01:I know. For me, anyways. Speaking personally.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, for
SPEAKER_01:me as well. So what is oil down? When you mentioned the food, what is oil down? What is it?
SPEAKER_04:It's throwing all the great ingredients into a pot. It's ground provisions. It's breadfruit. It's... around anywhere you go on the island is added into this pot. You could do it either with seafood or with different meats. It's not a And I don't want to say it's a stew. It's somewhere. It's a marriage there in the middle. Somewhere in between. Yes. But it is definitely a must try on the island. You can't say you've been to Grenada and not try our national dish.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Talk about some of the accommodation options that are available.
SPEAKER_04:Absolutely. So we have, you know, everything from, you know, five, five star accommodations to, you know, our simple stays. We have, of course, the Six Senses at La Suggest that opened in 2024. It's a beautiful property focused on wellness. We have Silver Sands and they have, you know, two properties. They also have the Beach House, which is absolutely beautiful as a boutique property. We also have Mount Cinnamon Beach Resort, which recently announced that they're going to be focusing on wellness. So it's Mount Cinnamon Beach and Wellness Resort. They recently underwent some renovations and I went recently to have a curated dining experience with wine pairing that was simply delicious. So for the foodies, Mount Cinnamon is also a great option. We also have Mount Cinnamon Beach Resort, which recently announced that they're going to be focusing on wellness. We also have Calabash, which is another amazing property that has been on the island for well over 20 years, locally owned and operated. And they are now in the construction phases of adding six suites to their offerings. On the horizon, we have the Intercontinental property, which will open in 2026, and they will be boasting just about 150 rooms and 600 square feet of event space, and they're going to be located right next door to the Sixth Census property, same ownership. So we have great accommodations offerings that, you know, it just, it runs the gamut. It depends on, you know, what you're looking for.
SPEAKER_01:Nice. So when's the best time to go? You know, we are in the middle of hurricane season, but it seems to me that you are further south and sort of away from the hurricane belt.
SPEAKER_04:Right. So again, the peak season is November through April, which is, of course, that's going to be the time where sometimes the rates are a bit higher because that's when we see a lot of North American travelers. If you're coming in, if you want to stay at, let's say, the Silver Sands and be able to experience that property at less cost, I would say, you know, maybe May through June. August. August is a great time because if you like all things carnival, you have to come down to experience our Spice Mass, which is right now you cannot find a room on the island. You know, flights are at full capacity. It is a time of year that we see regional visitors, you know, diaspora visitors, visitors internationally that come down to experience Spice Mass. It's a great collaboration. of music and just having a great time. So I think August is, you know, for those people who like to travel around events and festivals, it's also a great time to come to the island. Really and truly, any time of the year, it just depends on, you know, what you are looking for. Do I want to be in the thick of the peak period where it's, you know, we're in hotels at full occupancy versus, you know, a time that is a bit more quiet? Or do I want to be there and revel with locals during Spice Mass.
SPEAKER_01:Well, there's Spice Mass. What are some of the other events that people can sort of watch out for?
SPEAKER_04:Absolutely. So we have our Grenada Chocolate Fest and that's held annually in May. So we just saw the successful conclusion of that. We also are getting ready to stage our Dive and Conservation Festival. And that is something that's going to come up in October. We also have Carriacou Regatta Festival, which is going to be from August 1st through the 4th. That's everything around, of course, sailing. I mentioned Spice Mass. That's going to be August 4th through the 11th. And we have the exact date for the Dive and Conservation Festival, which is October 25th to November 1st. And then we also have the Carriacou Parang Festival, which is going to be in December. So we have quite a few festivals that we promote throughout the year. I'm excited because we're going to be adding the Lobster and Lambie Festival at the beginning of the year in January. And that's going to be staged between Carriacou and Petit Martinique. We're going to roll out the dates in the next month. And Lambie, in case you're wondering, is conch. We call it Lambie. And so it really speaks to the Petit Martinique because fishing is the heart of that community So to be able to get, you know, fresh seafood and have it prepared how you like it and be able to watch cooking demonstrations and be able to have that prepared in a way maybe you've never had it before is something that we're looking forward to.
SPEAKER_01:Well, it all sounds very exciting.
SPEAKER_04:Anything you want to add? really sets us apart from other destinations is really the warmth of the people, the safety of the island, our extensive offerings.
SPEAKER_01:Stacey Liebert is CEO of the Grenada Tourism Authority. PureGrenada.com is where you can go to plan your visit to Grenada. Thanks for your time, Stacey. I really appreciate it.
SPEAKER_04:Thank you. Have a great day.
SPEAKER_01:This is the Informed Traveler podcast. I'm Randy Sharman. Just want to remind you of our website, theinformedtraveler.org. That's where you can find our contact page if you have any questions or comments about the podcast. You can also email me, too, with any questions or show segment ideas you might have. My email address is randy at theinformedtraveler.org. And if you want to get up-to-date travel info through the week or just see a few amusing travel stories and links, you can like us on Facebook at facebook.com slash informedtraveler on Instagram at informedtraveller or on X at informedtraveller. Plus, you can now sign up for our monthly newsletter. It's released at the beginning of every month. Just go to our website, theinformedtraveller.org, click on the newsletter button, and it'll take you right there. Or better yet, you can subscribe to it and have it arrive in your inbox each month. So we have a bonus segment for you this week. Every month or so, we like to get caught up with the folks from Booking.com, and they recently released Hi, Danny.
SPEAKER_00:Hi, how are you?
SPEAKER_01:I'm well. It's been a while since we've chatted. How has your summer been so far?
SPEAKER_00:It has been great. Super, super busy. Just the way I like beautiful weather and lots of activities to do outdoors.
SPEAKER_01:Well, that's kind of what we're going to talk about with the Booking.com survey on summer trends. Let's just talk about the survey itself. And how did you come about all the numbers?
SPEAKER_00:Well, we search to understand what is the appetite for traveling, what is the customer looking for, so we can really adapt and make sure that we have all the offers there. And it always comes surprising because it doesn't decrease the appetite for travel. That's almost the number one budget that the families and couples are making sure that they have in spare and they are dedicating time to. and their budgets towards it. So more than 72% of Canadians say that they are doing something for the summer for sure.
SPEAKER_01:Who did you ask? These are actual travelers, right?
SPEAKER_00:These are actual travelers who have the desire to travel within the next 12 months. And we are very proud to have this type of assessment so we can really have the indicators and the temperature check of the market.
SPEAKER_01:Well, let's talk about some of the numbers then. It looks like Canadians are wanting to travel this summer. The optimism, 72% of Canadian leisure travels are excited about exploring the world this summer, even though we're almost halfway through. Well, it
SPEAKER_00:goes fast. You have to plan early and it goes fast. But even if you haven't planned, there's plenty to do. And in the platform, you can still find last minute deals. And very exciting plans before the summer ends.
SPEAKER_01:And it's not just like, it seems like everybody, like it's not just couples, it's families, it's groups that are increasing in numbers, it seems.
SPEAKER_00:Yes, we want to be together. We are really, what we are seeing is the traveler really looking for community and looking for experiences, outdoor experiences, learning new things, experiencing, seeing new things, and especially the families really to make sure they expose the kids to different information and allow the kids to explore the world and start increasing knowledge and curiosity about their country and what it's about that destination.
SPEAKER_01:Well, and did cost... come into a factory here because it seems to me like green spaces, natural habitats, those types of things, they're all free, right? I mean, sometimes you pay an entrance to a park, but really, if you're talking about going to a lake or hiking in the mountains, these are one of the most inexpensive activities you could do, right?
SPEAKER_00:How amazing is that, right? You just wake up in the morning, have your cup of coffee, have your breakfast with your family, pack your snacks and just go on a hike and see these beautiful scenes that Canada has to offer the forest, the lakes, the rivers, and just enjoy the outdoors, get that vitamin D and, and experiences together.
SPEAKER_01:And that being said, according to the survey, 87% of Canadian parents say they're looking for trips to expose their children to a variety of different cultural experiences, historic landmarks, dare I say the word museum, because it seems to me that children just kind of roll their eyes when they go to a museum. But nowadays, I think museums in general have done a really good job to attract younger guests, haven't they?
SPEAKER_00:Well, they made it... more informal and interactive. And I guess with all the technology you get to go listening to the story yourself, you can get the headsets and listen to the story of every inch of the museum. That's kind of exciting, but hey, There is so much historical spots in Canada that you have this open museums. As an example, if you go to Quebec City, you have the Plains of Abraham, that's historical scene itself. And as you walk through the park, you get to see the families just sharing information and Googling and checking in their cell phones what happened in this spot. And you have, of course, throughout the park, the information that you can go discovering together with the family and The kids go super exciting, kind of a treasure hunt of historical facts. So Canada has plenty of spaces that you can be outdoors, learning history, learning new facts without being in a formal space.
SPEAKER_01:Well, and one thing that surprised me is the city of Winnipeg, highlighted as one of the nine destinations in the world that makes it easier to travel sustainably. This is according to your survey. I guess Winnipeg, even though it's not on a lot of people's radar, it does have museums like Canadian Museum for Human Rights. There's the art gallery there. And it's a short drive to some of the lakes and and all the other outdoor activities that Manitoba has to offer,
SPEAKER_00:right? 100%. You have the kayaking, hiking, camping. And you can also get in tune with the history of Canada and understand more about how we develop to what we are right now. But the natural beauty for sure. The sustainability aspect is very important for the travelers nowadays. And Winnipeg has done a great job in certifying the accommodations and have the accommodations really adapting to the new ways of operating to be more sustainable. And the travelers 100% appreciate that. And the natural landscape and the care they take with all of that is something that travelers want to take part in. by eating local, sourcing local, and understanding how they can collaborate with the tourism, with the community, on a way that we're going to preserve it and have it for many years to come.
SPEAKER_01:One thing, it wasn't part of your survey, but it just came to mind, and it's still just expanding on Winnipeg, is that Indigenous tourism is taking off. And there's a lot of that around Winnipeg and the Manitoba area, too.
SPEAKER_00:And that has increased interest 100% because you can book tours for you to understand more and learn the histories, the legends, the folklore, which has been an amazing way for us to grow our knowledge about culture, about history and respect for the future.
SPEAKER_01:Still a number of weeks left in the summer. So people are looking to get away. I guess booking.com is the place to go because you can handle everything, right? You can handle your flights if you're flying somewhere or accommodations, of course. Even we talked about tractions and things like that, tickets to attraction sites and everything. It just really is a one-stop place to go, isn't it?
SPEAKER_00:It's a one-stop shop. You have deals going on. Once you make your log, you get access to multiple discounts and you have the trip planner where you can just come with the craziest idea. And the app is going to help you plan your trip with minimal friction and just saving you time so you can enjoy summer.
SPEAKER_01:It's the Survey on Summer Trends with Booking.com. You can find more information on Booking.com or some great ideas on taking the rest of the summer or taking a vacation in the summer. Dani Musi, Area Manager for Canada with Booking.com. It's always fun to chat with you, Dani. Thanks so much.
SPEAKER_00:Thank you for having me.
UNKNOWN:Thank you.
SPEAKER_01:And that is our show for this week. If you have comments or questions, we'd love to hear from you. If you have a show idea, send that along as well. My email is randy at theinformedtraveller.org. And if you like what you heard, tell a friend. You can check out our website too at theinformedtraveller.org. In the meantime, thanks for listening. Travel safe and be an informed traveler.